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Calif. Mtn. Safeway Location?

Posted: 04 Aug 2022 11:06
by Old_Dragon
In January 1978 a young lady and I took a weekend trip to somewhere in the mountains (southern?) of California. Sadly my notes of where we went are nonexistent yet I have this poor panorama photo taken from the deck of our rental house.

In it, with a little patience, one can spot a Safeway store. Using Google Maps I have exhausted the likely locations (to include Big Bear, Mammoth Lakes, etc.) but have been unable to find a sure location based on terrain (the mountain to the left is distinctive). So I am requesting help in possible candidate locations. TNX

Re: Calif. Mtn. Safeway Location?

Posted: 07 Aug 2022 03:10
by storewanderer
Looks like a rather desolate location. Definitely not Mammoth Lakes or Big Bear. Could it have been a spot down closer to the Mexico border (like Alpine area?)?

Do you recall any other businesses surrounding or nearby the store?

Maybe a long closed store, which would make it that much harder to identify.

Re: Calif. Mtn. Safeway Location?

Posted: 07 Aug 2022 13:16
by Old_Dragon
Storewanderer
Thank you for the reply. Concur with your desolate observation. At the time I was living in Hermosa Beach and spent my mountain time north of LA to include the Sierras along 395. I cannot recall ever spending any time to the south. The photo is one from a box of slides. Other activities captured on film are easily identifiable. On the box exterior I “documented” at some point in the past what was captured. There is an entry which says Mt Baldy. But, there does not appear to be Safeway in Mt Baldy today, I cannot get a good match on the terrain using Google and it’s hard for me to believe that Safeway had such a large store for an area which even today let alone 50 years ago is pretty small. Hence my quest for alternative locations. TNX

Re: Calif. Mtn. Safeway Location?

Posted: 09 Aug 2022 03:29
by storewanderer
Looking around, I am looking around CA-2 around Wrightwood. I still can't find this store. But the terrain strikes me as getting closer.

Running Springs?

Looked over at Acton but I don't think the terrain works.

I think we can rule out this store being a Vons at this point but it would be very interesting to find it. It may have been a dud location. Safeway historically threw a lot of stores up in a lot of random locations. For ones like this that obviously didn't do so well, they had some where they struck gold (such as the group of stores around Lake Tahoe, or out in the mountains in Colorado).

I do think Mt. Baldy/Mt. San Antonio terrain looks right though... just can't find this store...

Re: Calif. Mtn. Safeway Location?

Posted: 10 Aug 2022 10:56
by Old_Dragon
Morning
Agree Wrightwood is a possibility. Sitting elevated on the north side of the Angeles Crest Highway and looking south one might be able to see Mt Baldy and since this was "winter" snow covering would be likely. Its unfortunate that the photo quality and aging make discerning the peaks in the distance difficult. The problem with Wrightwood is that there are few, today, buildings on the north side of the hwy that might have served as the rental and taking a Google Streetview journey down the highway I cannot see evidence of any of the other buildings visible in the photo. Looking through gaps in the trees to the right there are what appear to be two square business buildings sitting somewhat elevated above the hwy. I cannot find anything that is a reasonable match. In addition, there is an A-Frame house on the hill to the right and I cannot find that neither nor evidence of the dirt road that sweeps up behind the Safeway on an elevated berm and appears to wind its way of the hill behind it. Unfortunately I don't live in CA anymore, now its CO, or I'd be up driving the mountains to check things out in person. Thank you for your observations and I appreciate your assistance in my quest.

Re: Calif. Mtn. Safeway Location?

Posted: 20 Aug 2022 04:27
by storewanderer
Still coming up blank on this.

Also in the photo I see what appears to be a Shell station to the right of the Safeway.

I think there is a Safeway store directory here somewhere... I don't know when it is from or if it had SoCal on it but if we can track that down it may help.

Re: Calif. Mtn. Safeway Location?

Posted: 20 Aug 2022 13:04
by Old_Dragon
Your observation re. a Shell station is interesting. I tried re-working that portion of the image to see if I could enhance it. I do not have very sophisticated software so my attempt is feeble. However, I can almost convince myself that maybe it’s a Carl’s Junior sign that I am seeing as it has the same color scheme as that for Shell. I have expanded my search beyond southern California. The photos on the roll preceding the photo in question were of a ski trip to Mammoth Lakes. While I do not have any in-town shots, they do show a tremendous amount of snow at lower elevations in addition to what is expected on the mountain proper. in the photo in question, the snow is sparse at lower elevations. On that basis I initially discounted Mammoth as a possibility but have since taken to looking at Google Streetview. I’m not seeing any likely terrain candidates so continue to discount Mammoth as a possibility. TNX

Re: Calif. Mtn. Safeway Location?

Posted: 25 Aug 2022 23:58
by Bluelightspecial
Initially I thought it was Frazier Park, but the old Safeway that was there doesn't look like that. It is an old A-Frame type store that is now a hardware store. It could be Lake Arrowhead, as the Stater Bros there now (while the facade is different) is laid out similarly with the loading dock on the left hand side.

Re: Calif. Mtn. Safeway Location?

Posted: 27 Aug 2022 11:34
by Old_Dragon
Thanks for the search. Given that buildings come and go I’m trying to key-off the terrain as much as possible as well as the likelihood that a Safeway was at the candidate location at that time. The photo was clearly taken from an elevated position, the mountain to the left has a distinctive rocky summit, the canyon is fairly narrow and one can see numerous snow covered “peaks” in the distance. California is a big state with lots of places to cover and while Google is pretty good it still has gaps but I have a lot of candidate ground yet to search. TNX

Re: Calif. Mtn. Safeway Location?

Posted: 28 Aug 2022 02:23
by TiManny
Bluelightspecial wrote: 25 Aug 2022 23:58 Initially I thought it was Frazier Park, but the old Safeway that was there doesn't look like that. It is an old A-Frame type store that is now a hardware store. It could be Lake Arrowhead, as the Stater Bros there now (while the facade is different) is laid out similarly with the loading dock on the left hand side.
I looked at the Google satellite view of the Lake Arrowhead Stater Bros and it looks like a strong possibility. The store sits below the road behind it (Hwy 189), and the road slopes and curves downward to the left behind the store if you're looking at the storefront. The surroundings have been completely built up, so if this is it, it was probably fairly new in 1978. The thing that might rule out Arrowhead is the location where the picture was taken. Could it have been taken from across the lake without getting the actual lake in the shot? Or were there cabins between the lake and the store in 1978 that were torn down for modern development?

Edit: I checked Historic Aerials and the Arrowhead Stater building was there in 1980. Would Stater Bros have had a store in the mountains in 1980?

Re: Calif. Mtn. Safeway Location?

Posted: 28 Aug 2022 12:26
by Old_Dragon
Morning. Initially I looked at Lake Arrowhead and Big Bear. I contacted the visitor center at Big Bear and was told that at one time there was a Safeway. However the location they give me didn’t match. In any event neither Lake Arrowhead nor Big Bear give me a “peak” with a rocky summit that comes close to the one on the left side of the panorama shot. Admittedly Google Streetview doesn’t always provide 100% coverage so I’m not ruling out either location but at the moment I don’t see them as strong candidates. TNX

Re: Calif. Mtn. Safeway Location?

Posted: 28 Aug 2022 21:51
by TiManny
I found the master list storewanderer was referring to. The links to the map no longer work, so we can't see the individual LA, Bay Area, San Diego or Sacramento locations, but the thread lists the rest. No store in Lake Arrowhead or Mt. Baldy but apparently there were stores in both Big Bear City and Big Bear Lake.

https://www.groceteria.ca/board/viewtop ... 341a6ba7d2

Re: Calif. Mtn. Safeway Location?

Posted: 31 Aug 2022 04:02
by storewanderer
Looks like Stater got the liquor license on Lake Arrowhead in 1981. Loading dock positioning is dead on but in the Safeway picture there looks like HVAC etc. on the roof above the loading dock and none of that is present on the Stater. It is possible Stater did some expanding, etc.

Re: Calif. Mtn. Safeway Location?

Posted: 05 Sep 2022 11:50
by Old_Dragon
Since my last post I’ve done the following. Communicated with a real estate broker who has been selling in the Big Bear area for the past 35 years. He assures me that the geography in the photo is not present in the Big Bear area. I’ve also communicated with the History Museum in Mammoth Lakes. They also tell me that the geography is not associated with the Mammoth Lakes area (have yet to check on June Lake). I sent a note off to a real estate broker in Wrightwood asking the same question but as of yet have not received a reply.

A close look at the photo suggests that there are relatively long shadows on the trees going from left to right? In my mind this would imply an early to mid morning shot and I am looking south or a mid to late afternoon shot and I am looking north. In either case the road that runs past the Safeway is generally running east-west? Its unfortunate that as of yet no one has been able to retrieve the images of the greater LA area Safeway Map that TheStranger posted years ago. As TiManny posted, the links no longer work. TNX

Re: Calif. Mtn. Safeway Location?

Posted: 16 Sep 2022 10:47
by Old_Dragon
So, to narrow my search I made an attempt to locate a copy of the referenced 1976 Calif map. Some libraries have it as it can be found in the Worldcat reference tool. Unfortunately all the libraries are several hundred miles away and my local library cannot obtain it through an inter-library loan. I have not been able to find one on eBay as of yet. For the near term I’m more or less stuck but will continue to hunt for likely candidates time permitting.